Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Numbers in the notice of Pelafina's death notice

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Numbers in the notice of Pelafina's death notice

    Note: I used the search feature to look for any topic regarding numebers, whoever none of the threads I found covered the below subject. If something sliped through the search filter, kindly link me to that thread. Thank you.

    Toward the bottom of the letter from the second Director to Johnny (Page 643 in of Leaves, page 77 in The Whalestoe Letters), dated May 5, 1989, there is a set of two strands of numbers. I'll reproduce them:

    #669-951381-6634646-94
    #162-111231-1614161-23


    Now, nothing about the strikes me as odd, perhaps an added touch by MZD to make the letter seem more authentic, as if it was official paperwork sent out by a clinic.

    However, the thing that makes me think about them anymore beyond the above point, is how they do not appear at the bottom of the letter from The Whalestoe on Janurary 12, 1989 (Page 639 in of Leaves, page 73 in The Whalestoe letters). Both letters are nearly identical in form, the only difference being the directoral party who wrote them (the unnamed first Director, and David J. Draines, the second Director).

    Does anyone have any idea what they could mean? Something I've passed over, or maybe some sort of coded connected? I'm not sure.

    Am I simply looking for meaning or mystery where there is none? Probably, but you never know.
    Last edited by CpVb006; 09-03-2006, 05:29 PM.

  • #2
    Well there was this thread, not that that's going to help you much. I think there may have been some speculation elsewhere as well, but to my knowledge no-one's come up with anything conclusive. Or even particularly interesting, really. Sorry.

    Comment


    • #3
      Yeah, not too much there, but it's good to see some others had noticed and pondered about it before.

      I tried adding them up in a few different ways, dividing them, subtracting them, and found nothing at all similar or conclusive.

      The three-six-seven-two (3-6-7-2) number sequence isn't indictive of anything is it? Definetly not a phone number, a social security number, or anything lelse I can think of.

      And if it was [something like] her patient ID, why would there be two? She wasn't even admitted twice, so I'm pretty sure that's out too.

      Comment


      • #4
        There's also this thread.

        Comment


        • #5
          (reposted from of Leaves forum) I don't believe any of this has been posted, so if you do know of where it has, please link it, it's 2:38am and I might have missed a thread.

          Disclaimer done.

          I was goofing around with the two number sequences at the bottom of page 643, the letter notifying Johnny that P has died.

          If you add up all the digits of the two sequences it totals 139. Add up those digits and it totals 13. Lastly, 1 + 3 is 4.

          If she was 59 when she died in 1989 then she was born in 1930. 1930 would follow the same addition as above to end up at 4.

          Page 643 is the 669th page in the book, which are the first three digits in the first sequence.

          643 also adds up to 4 following the previously mentioned method.

          She died May 4th, and a casket, service and burial plot would come to a total of $4,000. The digits of 4,000 also add up to 4.

          That is all for now.

          Comment


          • #6
            The letters on that page?

            "The endpapers of the US hardcover edition of the novel contain hexadecimal characters, which are actually an AIFF audio file of an excerpt from Poe's track "Angry Johnny" when saved as a file in a hex editor."

            Stolen from Wikipedia.

            Just stating that simply...
            The numbers could be something of the sort.
            Who knows.
            Not me.
            Not you.
            Possibly, not even the .

            Comment


            • #7
              That was brilliant. Well done.

              Comment


              • #8

                #669-951381-6634646-94
                #162-111231-1614161-23
                I've been pondering these again. Trying to figure out what they could mean.

                Ell pointed out to me that the numbers both are of a form 3 digits, 6 digits, 7 digits and then 2 digits. Looking at them even closer I saw they had several digits that were in the same position in the top line and the bottom line.

                6(6)9-95(1)38(1)-6(6)3(4)646-94
                1(6)2-11(1)23(1)-1(6)1(4)161-23

                Recalling that 669 is the actual page number in of Leaves that the numbers appear on. I decided to leave the 6's in, but removing all the other duplicates we end up with this:

                669 95 38 663 646 94
                162 11 23 161 161 23

                In The Whalestoe Letters book the numbers appear on printed page 77, this is actually the 95th page of the book.

                So there are the first two numbers 669 and 95 both corresponding to the actual pages the numbers appear on in HoL and TWL respectively. I wondered if the rest of them could be references to pages in HoL and TWL as well. So I looked up the pages in each book and found some striking similarities.

                Page 11 (actual page number)

                xi (printed page number) HoL: First page of the Introduction.

                xi TWL: First page of the Foreward.


                Page 23

                xxiii HoL: Last page of Introduction. Johnny is talking about how some time in the future you will realize you have changed.

                5 TWL: 1/20/83 Letter. P. talks about how the Director is a good man. (This letter can be found on page 589 of HoL)


                Page 38

                12 HoL: Karen rushes to the door to greet Navidson, but is cool calm and reserved by the time she answers it. Johnny tells us about the hot water being out, which leads to the admission that he added the word "water" in The Navidson Record.

                20 TWL: 3/7/85 Non sum qualis eram. Translates as: I am not what I used to be. (628 HoL)


                Page 94

                68 HoL: Navidson finds his way out after getting lost during Exploration A.

                76 TWL: 3/3/84 P's last letter. The day before she finds her way out of life. (668 HoL)


                Page 95

                69 HoL: Beginning of footnote 77. This footnote contains "known some call is air am."

                77 TWL: The Director's letter with the numbers.


                Page 161

                135 HoL: Talks about mutiny against Magellan, Holloway and the betrayal of Quesada by his servant Molino. (Although it says that Molino accepted, it does not say if he ever carried out the execution of Quesada.)


                Page 162

                136 HoL: More talk of mutiny.


                Page 646

                620 HoL: 5/8/87 P's acrostic letter. If I remember right she accuses the New Director of raping her. Later on page 635 she says there was no New Director just the old one showing that either his actions have changed since she said he was a good man and/or her opinion of him has changed.


                Page 663

                637 HoL: 11/27/88 Day after Johnny visits.
                One lifetime ago I was crouched in shadow and
                in the next I am with you. How profound the
                differance.

                Page 669

                643 HoL: The Director's letter with the numbers.


                Lots of reference to change in personality or behavior.
                Last edited by heartbreak; 04-10-2009, 02:27 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by heartbreak View Post
                  6(6)9-95(1)38(1)-6(6)3(4)646-94
                  1(6)2-11(1)23(1)-1(6)1(4)161-23
                  And taking the other route, keeping the similar digits and tossing the rest out:

                  6-11-64

                  Originally posted by TZD
                  It is November sixth, we are in Madrid, Spain and it is a very very important date. To celebrate, Anne will sing a song.
                  Wedding anniversary, perhaps?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by heartbreak View Post
                    6-11-64

                    TZD: It is November sixth, we are in Madrid, Spain and it is a very very important date. To celebrate, Anne will sing a song.

                    Wedding anniversary, perhaps?
                    Where is this TZD quote from?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by MoleculaRR View Post
                      Where is this TZD quote from?
                      Haunted

                      Edit: Right before Spanish Doll.
                      Last edited by heartbreak; 10-12-2011, 10:44 AM. Reason: More info.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by heartbreak View Post
                        Wedding anniversary, perhaps?
                        I like that. That could very well be it.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by fearful_syzygy View Post
                          I like that. That could very well be it.
                          :nods:

                          This came up in a search of the New York Times for Danielewski. You have to pay to view but I think we can get the gist of it. The title is "Priscilla Machold to Wed" and it is dated June 21, 1964.

                          If the numbers are supposed to indicate Nov. 6th, 1964, I think the next question is why is MZD linking P.'s suicide to his parents wedding day (making that assumption that is)?

                          I have three possibilities.

                          First, and probably most obvious, would be Priscilla herself. Maybe the marriage was a type of suicide for her. Which of course might have led to distances, unknown spaces between her and TZD if it went unspoken. Possibly leading to the same situation that is presented in Will and Karen's story. Which ultimately lead to Karen leaving, which is what Priscilla did as well. Of course there is also the convenience of Priscilla could be shortened to P.

                          A counter to that would be in the conversation with Rick Moody at PEN, Moody asked if of Leaves was a bit auto-biographical and MZD commented that P. was an other mother (don't quite remember how he worded it). Which could be interpreted two ways, either P. is not meant to be his mother at all or P. is his mother but at a time in her life so different than who she is now.

                          Another possibility is Pearl S Buck. TZD and Buck worked on several projects together. I can dig up my references on this if anyone is curious, but there is a biography of Buck that claims that after her husband died she was expecting TZD to marry her. Her husband died in 1960 so I think its at least a bit possible that she was let down when TZD married someone else. They worked on projects together at least up until 1965's The Guide. Pearl could be shortened to P. as well and there are quite a few references to deer in of Leaves.

                          The last possibility that I can think of would be TZD's first wife. They had a son together. Beyond that I know very little.

                          I think I remember in an interview that MZD said he liked doing things in three's and four's. I'll have to go back and see if I can dig it up. Perhaps, P. is meant to be all three.
                          Last edited by heartbreak; 10-14-2011, 05:28 AM. Reason: fixed a few typos

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by heartbreak View Post

                            ...

                            6(6)9-95(1)38(1)-6(6)3(4)646-94
                            1(6)2-11(1)23(1)-1(6)1(4)161-23

                            Recalling that 669 is the actual page number in of Leaves that the numbers appear on.

                            ...

                            Page 669

                            643 HoL: The Director's letter with the numbers.


                            Lots of reference to change in personality or behavior.

                            Here's a simpler take from someone who couldn't code her way out of a paper bag...

                            If the first 3 numbers of the 1st number is the actual actual the book, the couldn't the first 3 numbers of the 2nd number equally refer to the actual page in the book?

                            So if 669 = 643, then 162 = 136...
                            The next 3 sets of numbers could be lines, characters, words on the page.

                            Without having an electronic copy to count those options, I'm shooting in the dark, but those 2 numbers look as though they refer to 2 words - 1 per page...

                            Comment

                            Working...
                            X